3 rasions why i give up !!

Tho i was enjoying FM 09 for some period, but at the end had just to give up playing for those reasons, hope SI fix it for next year

1- speed and acceleration look non effective as in real life , in FM Henry, CR or wallcot are not the same as RL. I updated my game yet still same thing, people talk about determination and other skills, effecting, well my players who is 20&19 in both acceleration and speed an good technically and anticipation wise, and in fact more happy and better condition than opposite def, but he simply can’t run faster than 13 speed and acc defender !! who chase him back !! I can understand people saying determination ..etc get effect, but common, my team is 1-0 down, sure any Striker will give 100%, may be he will not be 100% when it is 0-0 or 1-0 up, but when ur down all ST give 100%. I’m sure this is tune down to reduce amount of goals. But this is not realistic, and if there is any other variables effecting it, sure it is not correct, the balance was not right.

2- one of main thing I suffered from in FM, is condition of my team X facing opponent team, it seem the calculation of match for AI teams is slightly not effecting thier condtion as human teams, I played 3 match using same team in a weeks, by 3rd game, my players were average wise 88-92 in condition while opposition had 92-95 in average, even tho I put training at very light level for first 15 players, as I had 1 CL match, and one facing Roma and Milan, so had to play best players, with JUV had good physical manager !! but still oppotion condtion were better than me , i even rotated before those 3 games so my first 11 start with 100% conditon, while Roma did use same team for ages, but still i slope down badly than them after each match with condition for next game!! so really don’t get it, why AI condition always seem to recover better than us?

3- injuries, comn, had 7 in last 9 games !! almost one every game, had that for 3 different clubs !! and all were 100% and good condition. Trying to play matches with fast tempo, so player don’t hold the ball a lot and pass it directly as I order him, yet those injuries are not willing to stop. Yes in RL, some teams have 7 injuries at some times, but they are 1 club among 20 in league, but each time I start new game, same situation happen to me, the worst is there are no small knocks, it is in 70% for 1-2 month out, the rest are longer, and some times u get those small knocks for 1 week or some days but they are rare. SI should provide a slide in option section to reduce effect and appearance of those injuries per match, if there some who want tough game, fair enough, but I left all the time with frustration feeling when it comes to injures. I look to opposition teams, and honestly their injury list are all the time lower than me !! this is not fair and amount of injuries u take every time is unrealistic as it happen each time I start new game with another club. I have all the time 7-9 players who I can are injured or still not fit or bad condition because of a knock. While this seem never to happen for AI teams !! I lost to ROMA and Milan, as they were almost injury clear, and could fill full strength team, while I have to be settle with less strong side for Juv because all injuries I had.

Otherwise the game is almost perfect, and real joy to play, high in detail

But those above 3 just killed all joy of the game for me to continue,

And another thing wish SI fix is interview pre and post matches, the answers are so repetitive, and some Qs are really just waste of time, it didn’t bother me that much as above.

Overall, big big step forward from SI, hats off, but sorry need to fix above IMO. May be some like it hard, I just wish u added sliders for users to choose difficulty level. Because IMO, some issues are just not realistic and tuned a bit harder than RL.

Cheers

There are difficulty levels. If you manage someone like Man Utd, or Real Madrid, it is easy, whereas if you manage a team who is predicted to finish bottom of the lowest playable division, it is very hard.

FM07 was great, the series is just getting progressively worse. SI seem to be trying to do much too quickly.

Not sure about your first point. Your second and third points seem to be because of the tactics you use.

E.g. No. 2: Do you have high closing down and tight marking selected for all players, or all games? This tires your team out drastically if they are chasing the ball all over the pitch.

No. 3: This may be because you have set hard tackling. Imagine your players going full throttle into every challenge; it will obviously lead to injuries. But rememer, the opposition may also have hard tackling on many of your players, so this problem may be a litle out of your cotrol

There are difficulty levels. If you manage someone like Man Utd, or Real Madrid, it is easy, whereas if you manage a team who is predicted to finish bottom of the lowest playable division, it is very hard.

i totaly agree this is why i start with smaller teams allways, but wanted to give a try for big clubs,

and it is not about should we play tough game or easy one, it is about, some issues are not similar in RL, i can understadn we make some issues as hard as they are in RL, but honeslty it is not only me, we feel the game is set harder than what it is in RL.

sure not all aspects are wrong, i just pointed the 3 i found which are hard and harder than RL.

Not sure about your first point. Your second and third points seem to be because of the tactics you use.

E.g. No. 2: Do you have high closing down and tight marking selected for all players, or all games? This tires your team out drastically if they are chasing the ball all over the pitch.

No. 3: This may be because you have set hard tackling. Imagine your players going full throttle into every challenge; it will obviously lead to injuries. But rememer, the opposition may also have hard tackling on many of your players, so this problem may be a litle out of your cotrol

for first point, i chekced it with UTD & Arsenal, CR and juv.

for 2nd and 3rd, i'm not naive m8 in management, in fact i ordered my player to press only in my last 3rd, and didn't give any marking, and in fact i set my tackling to lowest , tho had to do it nromal in 2 matchs facing milan and Roma. but with the rest tackling was low not even normal. but i guess agree opponent may set to hard tackle, i seen them hammering my players, and get away with it with no cards, i had to play one match with 10 as had no sub to replace 4th injured players, 1 was out, and 2 get hard knocks, and condtions dropped for 60 and 65 and had to repalce them and not aggravte thier situation, then get a 4th injury. i guess ur hypotheses are correct, it is oppostion teams making thier tacklign hard, but this is not correct, as Ref should punish them more, so manager don't use it unless they are in big trouble, it is unfair to see my clubs having longest list of injuries becasue i think when AI X AI this never been used as much, resulting les injuries for oppostion teams. while my list is growing up.

Nice spelling on the thread name

Nice spelling on the thread name

Not everyone on this forum is going to be fluent in English so drop the spelling police act, you just look silly.

Shwan, in regards to your first point i've not really noticed any players with a considerably higher pace attribute being outrun/chased down by a player with a lesser stat but each to their own. Also your comment about all strikers giving 100% when their time is losing is completely wrong. When sides lose, players heads drop and thus this can affect the amount of effort they put in, of course some players bust a gut for the side when their losing, but it comes down to the individual and what their 'determination', 'work rate' and perhaps 'team work' stat are.

Your second point can have many factors, having players constantly running with the ball is going to knacker them out, making your players close down alot is going to mean a drop in condition, try to make sure your players aren't over-exerting themselves.

Can't help with your injury issue as i've not encountered any problems with injuries, this could be down to your training workload.

Yes i look silly, everyone spells reason as rasions....

Ter your off topic please get back to the topic in hand

There are difficulty levels. If you manage someone like Man Utd, or Real Madrid, it is easy, whereas if you manage a team who is predicted to finish bottom of the lowest playable division, it is very hard.

I disagree. That may be a relevant answer to someone who has reasonable tactical know how, but there are many users who find top flight management as difficult as LLM.

1 - At first I thought pace wasn't pronounced enough but having played the game a lot more I don't think it's necessarily true. Particularly in the lower leagues I notice players often getting outpaced by faster players. The problem is when you get into the top leagues and players like Agbonlahor do not seriously outpace slower defenders like they're seen to do quite often in real life. However, I think this is quite a minor issue that only effects very quick players at times, and could be down to things like starting position and other attributes, or even tactics. I haven't looked at it enough, particularly on 9.3.0, to come to a solid conclusion.

2 - I think AI mamangers make use of the 'Rest player for X days' feature that is in FM. If you have a lot of games in quick succession you should rest them from training and rotate them.

3 - It's been extensively discussed and most people are of the opinion that injuries are not a problem. A small number of people complain about a high number of injuries but this is something that happens in real life, and again it could be down to not only training but tactics as well.

I'm sorry you're not enjoying the game at the moment, but I feel the three things you've listed are more likely down to something you're doing wrong in some way (apart from perhaps the training issue)

Difficulty levels were also mentioned, and these are not needed. And not because you can choose a big club, as this doesn't always make the game easier due to the high expectations. But you can do or change many things to make the game as easy or as difficult as you like. Including:

Starting Reputation - The higher it is the more money and respect the club gives you at the start.

Attribute masking - Turn it off for an easier game.

Genie Scout - Use to find better players if your struggling.

Downloaded tactics - use as a quick fix or as a base to build your own.

Real time editor - use to edit you money/injuries/player attributes as you need to make the game easier.

Yes i look silly

Correct. As I mentioned not everyone is fluent in English on these forums.

Fm 07 and 08 were brilliant. 09 potentially sounded the best but it has not really lived up to expectations. Well i am not complaining im back to 08 which is still a bloody good game@!

Difficulty levels were also mentioned, and these are not needed. And not because you can choose a big club, as this doesn't always make the game easier due to the high expectations. But you can do or change many things to make the game as easy or as difficult as you like. Including:

Starting Reputation - The higher it is the more money and respect the club gives you at the start.

Attribute masking - Turn it off for an easier game.

Genie Scout - Use to find better players if your struggling.

Downloaded tactics - use as a quick fix or as a base to build your own.

Real time editor - use to edit you money/injuries/player attributes as you need to make the game easier.

Can't believe i'm going to say this, but I disagree

How a leopard changes it's spots, eh! I was dead against difficulty levels in 08, and i'm first to admit that the reason was that I was doing quite well. However, 09 has been an eye opener for me and my problem with your suggestions is that some of them can adversely affect someones game.

I would like to see an option where players can play the game in exactly the same way as everyone else, and not have to rely on thrid party software or unrealistic settings to make it easier for them.

Can't believe i'm going to say this, but I disagree

What?!!?!?

How a leopard changes it's spots, eh! I was dead against difficulty levels in 08, and i'm first to admit that the reason was that I was doing quite well. However, 09 has been an eye opener for me and my problem with your suggestions is that some of them can adversely affect someones game.

I would like to see an option where players can play the game in exactly the same way as everyone else, and not have to rely on thrid party software or unrealistic settings to make it easier for them.

I would like to see this as well, but not with the use of difficulty levels. I'd rather see a more intuative tactics system implemented, as well as useful standard tactics, that allowed even those without access to the tactics forum a chance to have an understanding of what works, what doesn't work and most importantly why.

I for one would never like to see actual difficulty levels implemented in a game like FM, I feel there are much better ways to make the game more accessable to everyone.

I would like to see this as well, but not with the use of difficulty levels. I'd rather see a more intuative tactics system implemented, as well as useful standard tactics, that allowed even those without access to the tactics forum a chance to have an understanding of what works, what doesn't work and most importantly why.

I for one would never like to see actual difficulty levels implemented in a game like FM, I feel there are much better ways to make the game more accessable to everyone.

Hooray, back to normal! I agree with this

Hooray, back to normal! I agree with this

And balance is restored

People say FM08 was great but back at ths time last year they were saying it was no good and FM07 was better. In 12 months time people will be saying FM09 was great...

Regarding your points, the first 2 seem really minor points to stop playing the game completely. The injuries thing has been discussed a lot and I think that people have to accept that there are a lot of injuries in real life - if you look at the numbers in the game they are pretty similar to the real numbers.

I dont see how you can say that the game is harder than it would be IRL. Could you manage a premiership club IRL? Could any of us? If you truly think about it we couldn't. Not unless we were used to the pressure of the job as being a footballer before it can bring.

I dont see how you can say that the game is harder than it would be IRL. Could you manage a premiership club IRL? Could any of us? If you truly think about it we couldn't. Not unless we were used to the pressure of the job as being a footballer before it can bring.

Spot on mate, there has to be a degree of realism. And the better the club the more time you have to spend adjusting the team to play well, as they wont just gel straight away in my experiences.

1 - At first I thought pace wasn't pronounced enough but having played the game a lot more I don't think it's necessarily true. Particularly in the lower leagues I notice players often getting outpaced by faster players. The problem is when you get into the top leagues and players like Agbonlahor do not seriously outpace slower defenders like they're seen to do quite often in real life. However, I think this is quite a minor issue that only effects very quick players at times, and could be down to things like starting position and other attributes, or even tactics. I haven't looked at it enough, particularly on 9.3.0, to come to a solid conclusion.

2 - I think AI managers make use of the 'Rest player for X days' feature that is in FM. If you have a lot of games in quick succession you should rest them from training and rotate them.

3 - It's been extensively discussed and most people are of the opinion that injuries are not a problem. A small number of people complain about a high number of injuries but this is something that happens in real life, and again it could be down to not only training but tactics as well.

I'm sorry you're not enjoying the game at the moment, but I feel the three things you've listed are more likely down to something you're doing wrong in some way (apart from perhaps the training issue)

Difficulty levels were also mentioned, and these are not needed. And not because you can choose a big club, as this doesn't always make the game easier due to the high expectations. But you can do or change many things to make the game as easy or as difficult as you like. Including:

Starting Reputation - The higher it is the more money and respects the club gives you at the start.

Attribute masking - Turn it off for an easier game.

Genie Scout - Use to find better players if your struggling.

Downloaded tactics - use as a quick fix or as a base to build your own.

Real time editor - use to edit you money/injuries/player attributes as you need to make the game easier.

first very very interesting points m8

1- ur right, and it could be because lower league players have lower mental and other skills, so speed & acc value gonna be more obvious, while in bigger clubs, they have good skills in those mental & others skills, so value of acc/pace become kind irrlevant, resulting players like wallcot or Agbonlahor don't pass slower players in EPL matches as they do in RL. i think tuning the effect of other skills on players runs should be a bit reduced.

2- well tried to train them in very light training level, may be try to rest them this time. and this what make that gap exist between my team and opposition AI teams.

3- about injuries, well believe me, rotating every match, training set to medium and light when player more than 1 match a week, no hard tackling, no pressing, trying not to hold on ball and pass it fast, not trying to play unfit or player lower than 95 in condition....etc. tried every method in the book. but always get 1 injury per 1-1.5 games, i tried that in 3 career. yes, players get injured, gone to physioroom, and currently there is 78 injuries, divided on 20 clubs, this is about less than 4 players injured or unfit per club. i never passed 10 weeks without acceding that figure. may be if u don't have it is as u said something i done wrong, and i'm not expert in FM, and tried all suggestions, how u think beginners can continue playing it, till reach ur level m8, they gonna be put off once that figures increase over and over every week. at least let them enjoy playing at start and then try increase difficulty on injuries occurrence step by step, till mastering the game. right now the game is so tough for beginners.

thanx for ur reply and u give me many good hints to work on, cheers m8

I dont see how you can say that the game is harder than it would be IRL. Could you manage a premiership club IRL? Could any of us? If you truly think about it we couldn't. Not unless we were used to the pressure of the job as being a footballer before it can bring.

Spot on mate, there has to be a degree of realism. And the better the club the more time you have to spend adjusting the team to play well, as they wont just gel straight away in my experiences.

i agree, tactically we are not up to it to do as big manager do in RL

but u want sure to see less injuries than RL, fast players can pass defenders like in RL

that is nothing to do with tactic, or choice of players,

if i had henry in my arsenal team, u expect him once getting a ball , that a slower player behind him not catching him !!! even when henry is 5m ahead

Managers job in RL is difficult, but to make it as difficult u give me RL problems, not things which don't exist in RL.

in real life though, the likes of agbonlahor and CR are not ALWAYS outpacing and skinning defenders, you just see the few times they do on match of the day and assume this is the norem. i think its quite realistic as i stil have trouble marking CR and agbonlahor on the game

i like raisons

There are difficulty levels. If you manage someone like Man Utd, or Real Madrid, it is easy, whereas if you manage a team who is predicted to finish bottom of the lowest playable division, it is very hard.

This is where the game fails a lot of its customers.

A lot of football fans want to be THEIR team and ONLY THEIR team. However just like the big decisions in football the game favours the glory hunting Man U fan over the loyal Rochdale fan.

Why do SI not seem to understand this?

This is where the game fails a lot of its customers.

A lot of football fans want to be THEIR team and ONLY THEIR team. However just like the big decisions in football the game favours the glory hunting Man U fan over the loyal Rochdale fan.

Why do SI not seem to understand this?

Under the assumption that the latter part of your post was intended to be somewhat tongue in cheek, the game is after all a simulation which tries to reflect the "real" world of football as closely as possible. How well SI manage to do that each release of course, is entirely down to the opinion of each individual gamer.

The main difference here is that year on year the realism of the game improves, so if you're managing your favorite Blue Square North side and harbouring dreams instant promotions and Champions League glory, the game is going to be much more difficult.

Sadly, much of the frustration towards tactics I read on the forums, tends to be because there isn't a Diablo-esque tactic around any more and people simply aren't prepared to work at or learn about tactics, inevitably blaming the game for being too difficult.

Perhaps SI should consider appeasing those who want a simple, "no frills" game where instant success is possible with any team or players, by releasing a dumbed down version called "Fantasy Football Manager", making sure that instead of having a suited, sheepskin coated or tracksuit wearing football manager image on the box cover, they have one of a bloke in a clown outfit, big floppy red boots 'n' all.

Nice spelling on the thread name

"3 Raisens why Im Scone" would have been better !

Under the assumption that the latter part of your post was intended to be somewhat tongue in cheek, the game is after all a simulation which tries to reflect the "real" world of football as closely as possible. How well SI manage to do that each release of course, is entirely down to the opinion of each individual gamer.

The main difference here is that year on year the realism of the game improves, so if you're managing your favorite Blue Square North side and harbouring dreams instant promotions and Champions League glory, the game is going to be much more difficult.

Sadly, much of the frustration towards tactics I read on the forums, tends to be because there isn't a Diablo-esque tactic around any more and people simply aren't prepared to work at or learn about tactics, inevitably blaming the game for being too difficult.

Perhaps SI should consider appeasing those who want a simple, "no frills" game where instant success is possible with any team or players, by releasing a dumbed down version called "Fantasy Football Manager", making sure that instead of having a suited, sheepskin coated or tracksuit wearing football manager image on the box cover, they have one of a bloke in a clown outfit, big floppy red boots 'n' all.

Midly annoying Post (SI have recently admitted that difficulty level is to be set by which team you chose to manage!), but saved somewhat by the comical last line!

shwan, I disagree with you..

1- speed ( pace & acc. ) is just as effective as real life.

2- I didn't notice this in my game.

3- About injuries, on the contrary I feel it's toned down unrealistic too much.

in real life though, the likes of agbonlahor and CR are not ALWAYS outpacing and skinning defenders, you just see the few times they do on match of the day and assume this is the norem. i think its quite realistic as i stil have trouble marking CR and agbonlahor on the game

yes but when facing a slow def and have space open in front of him, u will not see the slower recovering !! i'm not talking about when 2 players fighting over a ball and there is no space in front of them, but he is ahead with ball in his leg and open space in front of him, even lower technical players like Wallcot was able to pass players easier in RL.

i like raisons

because i'm French

This is where the game fails a lot of its customers.

A lot of football fans want to be THEIR team and ONLY THEIR team. However just like the big decisions in football the game favours the glory hunting Man U fan over the loyal Rochdale fan.

Why do SI not seem to understand this?

agree' date=' SI should think that there are people who are just beginners, and to see them losing over and over without any clues or guides, as we are not expert like some members here it is just frustrating experience

Under the assumption that the latter part of your post was intended to be somewhat tongue in cheek, the game is after all a simulation which tries to reflect the "real" world of football as closely as possible. How well SI manage to do that each release of course, is entirely down to the opinion of each individual gamer.

The main difference here is that year on year the realism of the game improves, so if you're managing your favorite Blue Square North side and harbouring dreams instant promotions and Champions League glory, the game is going to be much more difficult.

Sadly, much of the frustration towards tactics I read on the forums, tends to be because there isn't a Diablo-esque tactic around any more and people simply aren't prepared to work at or learn about tactics, inevitably blaming the game for being too difficult.

Perhaps SI should consider appeasing those who want a simple, "no frills" game where instant success is possible with any team or players, by releasing a dumbed down version called "Fantasy Football Manager", making sure that instead of having a suited, sheepskin coated or tracksuit wearing football manager image on the box cover, they have one of a bloke in a clown outfit, big floppy red boots 'n' all.

Managers games are not as realistic as RL tactics and difficulty anyway.

their difficulties are different, this is why best FM managers who can pack 10 titles in FM will find it hard if managing a club like UTD to win title in RL beginners when they comes, they don't know the best tricks to win, so they apply everyday knowledge they had from playing or watching football in RL, so it gonna be really slow for them to get used to it and not been disappointed, at least if they had options to reduce no. of injures at start will be very good till they master tactic or training.

i used to be playing FIFAM, and we had the line to amend in notepad, to fix the injures rate. till we get used to the game and make it as normal and sometimes increase it even after u master it.

shwan, I disagree with you..

1- speed ( pace & acc. ) is just as effective as real life.

2- I didn't notice this in my game.

3- About injuries, on the contrary I feel it's toned down unrealistic too much.

1- no way CR can be out-ran by 13 ACC/SPD def when we are 1-0 down, like he is not bothered, especially as his moral, fitness and condition were high. i play counter system trying to use maximum speed advantage of my players, but hardly get result.

2- try to play same team over 3 matches in one week, and look if u or opposition have same condition level, there is always 2-3% difference per match

3- average wise, u should have 4 (injured + unfit players < as shown in physioroom website>) that is hardly what i get in my 3 career. and it is not only me who is complaining about injuries.

==============================================

Anyway, I just wanted to give a hit for SI DEV, telling them my opinion.

We can argue endlessly

I thank many members who give me really nice advice

But unfortunately it is too late, I already uninstall the game, will give CM09 a try.

But sure will give try to apply those advices u give me next year.

cheers