Im sick of these stupid errors in games..

Now dont get me wrong, Im not whining here becuase Im losing, or I think the CPU is cheating. This errors happen for both teams and Ive gained and lost from them. But PLEASE can somebody from SI come out and just admit that they recognise some of the problems that have been listed here - and that they are trying to solve them:

1. Why are fullbacks totally imcopetent at defending? A) They dont make tackles - how often do they simple run alongisde wingers, and HOW OFTEN DO WINGERS GET IN BEHIND? - Watch a real game of football and I tell you, you will be hard pressed to find a winger totally beat his man and get around his fullback at all in the whole match at times - in FM it happens every 5 minutes. B) Why cant fullbacks clear a cross? How many times does a deep cross come into the box, the fullback totally misses it, resulting in a chance, or another deep cross where the exact same thing happens?

2. Space in the midfield - there is far too much - even in low level games, where trust me Ive watched Barrow before on a few occasions - you dont get more than three touches on the ball without a crunching tackle coming in, The pitch is either too big or the players too small on the game - where in the likes of the Scottish div 3 and the BSS, players are given far too much time on the ball as if we were playing in Serie A.

3. The attacking corner bug - Just so happens the two weakest headers of the ball in my current save game are my two wingers - So understandedbly and also commonly in real life, my two wingers drop back, the rest of the lads get themselves in and around the box. So what happens - Corner goes in, keeper claims it, surely thats OK, ive got two on one on the halfway line, oh dear maybe not, the keeper kicks it and whats this? The striker is clean through on goal? Yes thats right, instead of staying with there man until the rest of the team have gotten themselves back, the wingers have decided to not bother defending, and have ran forward, watching the ball sail over their heads as their striker runs clean through. Bizarre AND A BLATANT BUG - has this been seen to?

4. Keeper's making ridiculous decisions - trust me I dont mind my keeper making a howler or two - thats another thing that isnt in the game, the keeper spilling shots into their own net for example, never seen in these games where they either save the shot, or they miss it, nothing in between. But back onto the point, whats with the keeper's suddenly becoming mentally disabled in matches. Examples of this : OWN GOALS - the keepers make no attempt to save it, preferring to simply watch it rolling into the net. Another example is called the 'Let the ball hit me, ill just stand still, never mind syndrome'. This happens rarely, but is a BLATANT BUG. A through ball (usually) is too long, my keeper runs out to get it. In his attempt to PICK THE BALL UP!?! he somehow Fails to do this, but instead of trying again to pick it up or at worst even attempting to clear it, the keeper simply either stands there, DOING NOTHING? or runs back to his goal, slightly better but come on thats the lesser of two evils isnt it?

5. Games going on far too long and far too much extra time being added on. In real life, about %6.5 games get five minutes or more added time added on. In my experience of FM this percentage is about %20 - 30 at least, which is ridiculous. Games also commonley go on until the 98th or 97th minute, especially at lower levels, (I once saw a CPU game go like this, 4 - 3 was the score, the last 3 goals were scored from beyond the 94th minute mark.) which is quite ridiculous, and would never happen in real life.

6. Players standing with the ball at their feet for around 10 seconds plus, not moving, until they get tackled? Bizarre. BUG.

7. Some offsides are wrong by MASSIVE amounts.

8. Players do a slide tackle, and are then stuck in a sliding motion on the floor while the player who was slide tackled gets up and carries on.. Also, players get tackled, the falling motion happens, but they sometimes dramatically rise up and carry on with the ball? Surely a bug.

So in conclusion if you cant be bothered reading that:

1. Fullbacks awful defensively.

2. Far too much space and time in general, but mainly in the middle of the park.

3. Players on the half way line from an attacking set play, not defending afterwards, leaving nobody in their own half, leaving a striker clean through on goal.

4. Keeper's totally lack of common sense.

5. Too much added on time.

6. Players standing with the ball at their feet for 10+ seconds, doing nothing with it.

7. Some ridiculous offside decisions, like really poor ones, been in FM for a while.

8. Players doing sliding tackles and lying on the floor for around 5 seconds afterwards.

I have the 9.2.0 patch by the way, before you start.

SI, one question - do any of you or have you played football at a decent standard, or have any of you watched a sucession of games at low levels? Scottish div 3 for example?

Because the realism just isnt there, it is what it is, a SIMULATION - nothing more, and it should be, you can tell when watching a game on 3d that this is a virtual match, because players are robots on the game at the moment, there is no common sense involved, and you can always tell exactly what is going to happen when watching highlights.

Thank you, will appreiciate responses either citing the same errors in the thier game, responses who tell me im talking rubbish - I will happily argue as I know these mistakes exist, and more importantly, how many of these problems are under investigation?

I'm sick of these threads

^why post in them, then?

I too am sick of those errors. Drives me nuts sometimes. Hopefully they will be no more after the next patch!

The worst thing about all eight of those obvious bugs is that I don't think any of them were in the FM08 match engine. I just don't understand how they could work on it for an entire year and make it worse! Not just a little worse either - a lot worse.

Another thing that's really annoying is the ridiculous number of corners that go straight out of play. I sometimes resort to instructing my players to take out-swingers just to stop this happening.

Agree Miso, corners seem pretty poor at present.

And Insert_Goal_Here, why are you sick of these threads, Its detailed and 100% correct - do you want these issues sorted or not?

The worst thing about all eight of those obvious bugs is that I don't think any of them were in the FM08 match engine. I just don't understand how they could work on it for an entire year and make it worse! Not just a little worse either - a lot worse.

Another thing that's really annoying is the ridiculous number of corners that go straight out of play. I sometimes resort to instructing my players to take out-swingers just to stop this happening.

x2

Exactly, thats what i can not understand.

ok the match engine has gone through a drastic change to incorporate 3d -

8. is an example of limited animation of 3d (because you cant possibly see a sliding tackle in 2d) - its not a bug where he stays in one position its just the animation shows it, because 3d animation is limited so it works on lots of pc's

7. offsides get some appalling ones in real life as well... i dont have many really poor ones.

6 and 4 are what appear to be bugs

5 maybe a result of your tactics time wasting and subs

3 wingers have poor marking but this seems a bug as well and has stung me a couple times

2. 100m x 50m = 5000m squared of space - THERE IS LOTS OF SPACE

1. fullbacks do get beaten a lot, maybe a bug maybe not

You missed a few things:

I assume you have been playing CM/FM since the first edition.

Probably also fair to guess that you are unbeaten or on top of the table or massively overachieving with some small club, yes?

Finally it's safe to say that you have been watching real football, analysing and taking stats for nearly as long as you have been playing FM so all your statements are totally backed up by a legendary football knowledge.

So it should read like this:

To start, I've been playing CM/FM since Champan 92/93...

[wall of text]

I have a good RL football knowledge and I watch a lot of real football and I can tell you that this game...

[wall of text]

And by the way, I'm not just whining because I'm losing; I'm on top of the league with Hull but these bugs are...

[wall of text]

So, another loyal customer lost.

[sarcasm]Congrats SI/Sega.[/sarcasm]

Better luck next time

And Insert_Goal_Here, why are you sick of these threads, Its detailed and 100% correct - do you want these issues sorted or not?

How do you know you are 100% correct? did you develop or design the game? No, then you can not be sure if all of these errors you mention are bugs or not, or that they just happen because a random amount of variables occur during matches.

ok the match engine has gone through a drastic change to incorporate 3d -

8. is an example of limited animation of 3d (because you cant possibly see a sliding tackle in 2d) - its not a bug where he stays in one position its just the animation shows it, because 3d animation is limited so it works on lots of pc's

7. offsides get some appalling ones in real life as well... i dont have many really poor ones.

6 and 4 are what appear to be bugs

5 maybe a result of your tactics time wasting and subs

3 wingers have poor marking but this seems a bug as well and has stung me a couple times

2. 100m x 50m = 5000m squared of space - THERE IS LOTS OF SPACE

1. fullbacks do get beaten a lot, maybe a bug maybe not

I agree with most of this, but 2. yeah there is al lot of space, but the OP has a point by mentioning that the FB aren't as good, or aren't doing the FB job correct. The wingers just can dribble circles around the FB's and still give a decent pass.

How do you know you are 100% correct? did you develop or design the game? No, then you can not be sure if all of these errors you mention are bugs or not, or that they just happen because a random amount of variables occur during matches.

I agree with most of this, but 2. yeah there is al lot of space, but the OP has a point by mentioning that the FB aren't as good, or aren't doing the FB job correct. The wingers just can dribble circles around the FB's and still give a decent pass.

I have to agree with you on this comment!

Some things are indeed stupid things, but i can cope with em.... The thing i hate is that you lose at home to a much weaker side by a stupid 45 yard goal and after that no matter what you try you dont score... seriously i have tried it with 1 striker up till 5 strikers and a lot of AM and still they will miss every single shot...even if they were on the goalline...

How do you know you are 100% correct? did you develop or design the game? No, then you can not be sure if all of these errors you mention are bugs or not, or that they just happen because a random amount of variables occur during matches.

What a ridiculous thing to say. I don't need to be mechanic to know when my car isn't working.

The worst thing about all eight of those obvious bugs is that I don't think any of them were in the FM08 match engine. I just don't understand how they could work on it for an entire year and make it worse! Not just a little worse either - a lot worse.

Another thing that's really annoying is the ridiculous number of corners that go straight out of play. I sometimes resort to instructing my players to take out-swingers just to stop this happening.

What a ridiculous thing to say. I don't need to be mechanic to know when my car isn't working.

But are you always right in your opinion on what is defective when the cars breaks down?

And you can say for 100% sure that these items are bugs can you, that is as ridiculous as what I have said, only thing is we both see it in a different way.

Mind you, I agree on many of the items as well, but not saying that I am 100% correct (as mentioned in the post I quoted).

A bug is something that's not supposed to happen in the game. I'd be amazed - and appalled - if any of the OP's eight points were put in the match engine intentionally.

I don't need to know what causes the bugs to know that they're bugs.

Well for sure we will not agree here, that is no problem, a good discussion can do no harm. But how do you know for sure that it are bugs? I can't say that (and yes I hope that some of them will be solved with the next patch).

I don't see how there could be any other explanation. If they're not bugs, then why are they in the game? Surely they can't have been put there deliberately.

I am sick of the things that are in the game that are unrealistic also there are so many things

One can never get a good idea what's going on unless people can see the settings applied. I say this because I, personally, think some of the issues raised in this post can be caused by implemented settings...

A very nice post OP. These things are quite annoying, along with the mca/amc ratings, but that issue seems to have been acknowledged atleast.

Let's hope they are doing a large beta test for FM10, so we dont get this years injury bug and freeze if not playing in windowed mode, and 08s closing down bug. The last two years releases has brought scary flashbacks to the release of CM4

Off topic, anyone know when championship manager is released? Haven't tried it before, but I am a bit curious to see how they are doing things.

Guys , seriously , i am not saying game is perfect or even close to flawless. It has some daunting issues, but it is seriously playable. I can't say why you have tough times with game , could be anything, but game is playable.

Maybe some different approach to the game would be solution.I know one thing for sure, most of those ME mistakes can be brought down to minimum levels. Well except human players creating tons of 1 on 1.

I approached game as create high teamwork and work rate and make sure not to concede goal first, stop AI best players from playing , and then maybe look for something extra.Plus i adjusted trainings to emphasize Ball control and Tactics over anything else. It worked for me , maybe it can work for you. I haven't change match day tactics in last 40+ games and it still works(with minor tweaks during the game).And those are tactics that i am using from FM 05 or 06 (can't remember).

Most importantly , you will decide how you gonna have season with actions that you take in preseason, it does affects you tremendously.Use OI's , they can win match for you alone, if setup properly.

AI got goal from 1 on 1 against me maybe 4 times in some 100+ games and my FB was second in players of the season for 3 years in a row.Haven't had any injury crisis at all.

So give it a chance , seriously.I am not that great player at all, and if it works for me , it should work for people that are much more involved in this game then me.

Some of them are annoying but sometimes I just have to laugh. Like when a keeper makes a decent save then decides to stay on the ground for the next 20 seconds. Or when a keeper is chipped and it goes a bit above his head and he doesn't raises his arms but continues running forward. Or a keeper sprinting up full pace to the ball, watches it for a while before the striker simply dribbles it slowly towards an open net. All very frustrating, but a lot of the time it leaves me in hysterics.

Great game SI.

Keep it up !

Guys , seriously , i am not saying game is perfect or even close to flawless. It has some daunting issues, but it is seriously playable. I can't say why you have tough times with game , could be anything, but game is playable.

The game may be playable but that doesn't mean that it's very good.

The game may be playable but that doesn't mean that it's very good.

You are right. The game is not good, it is fantastic. Yeah, there are a few problems, but doesn't every game or piece of software have problems? Doesn't change it from being brilliant. I remember one of the Pro Evo's (on xbox), may have been pro evo 6 cant quite remember, but it had terrible problems when playing on xbox live. From connecting in the first place to being jittery when playing. However, this did not detract from how good the game was. Yes, it was a pain... but more than playable.

Worse things could happen, and ultimately, no-one is making you play it!

You missed a few things:

I assume you have been playing CM/FM since the first edition.

Probably also fair to guess that you are unbeaten or on top of the table or massively overachieving with some small club, yes?

Finally it's safe to say that you have been watching real football, analysing and taking stats for nearly as long as you have been playing FM so all your statements are totally backed up by a legendary football knowledge.

So it should read like this:

<snip>

Better luck next time

Really, what has this added to the thread? In fact, did you read the OP at all? The topic starter has made some good constructive points, as have the majority of people who replied in this thread, and responses like yours are just plain condesending and arrogant. I could understand the manner of your reply if the opening post was a just a rant, but it is a good summary of points he feels are in need of work within the game, and without topics such as this the game would not have evolved to the level it is at today. If you disagree with the points he has made, why not come up with a reply that debated them, and maybe offered him some advice on how to stop them happening?

Anyway back on topic, some of the points you have made I am sure are just graphical glitches (I.E. the sliding motion one) Others, such as the fullbacks not being able to defend is something I witnessed in 08, and it is dissapointing to hear that it has not been fixed for 09. (I have never played 09 so will have to take your word for it that this still happens).

I am of the opinion that we may start to see ME/graphical bugs fixed more efficiently starting with FM10, because the 3D graphical representation makes them so much more apparent and easier to spot.

You are right. The game is not good, it is fantastic. Yeah, there are a few problems, but doesn't every game or piece of software have problems? Doesn't change it from being brilliant. I remember one of the Pro Evo's (on xbox), may have been pro evo 6 cant quite remember, but it had terrible problems when playing on xbox live. From connecting in the first place to being jittery when playing. However, this did not detract from how good the game was. Yes, it was a pain... but more than playable.

Worse things could happen, and ultimately, no-one is making you play it!

The game is not brilliant - it is mediocre at best because of the large number of bugs and the poor match engine in a substantial number of people's opinion.

We clearly won't agree, so there's little point in further exchanges along these lines.

What a ridiculous thing to say. I don't need to be mechanic to know when my car isn't working.

No, but you would need a mechanic to tell you if your car has lost 1bhp - which is more accurate analogy. Because the game does actually work, and as said you don't know whether these are intentional or not.

The game is not brilliant - it is mediocre at best because of the large number of bugs and the poor match engine in a substantial number of people's opinion.

We clearly won't agree, so there's little point in further exchanges along these lines.

Substantial number of people would be you and other small amount that is making big noise on this forum.I am not saying that game is even close to brilliant , but it's not mediocre either.It has some features that are seriously outdated , but it is still very playable.That is if you don't look for "magic" way to beat everyone from day one.

WWfan was right in one thing,this ME is pretty much '07 ME without arrows (which itself is major improvement), but because of 3D we can see some things that were not that obvious in 2D. Defensively AI is very bad , but human defenders missing passes, FB letting crosses....i don't have that , unless i mess up in general.Took me some time to tweak things around, but there are gone.

In any case it beats FM '08 , which was seriously messed up and easy.

WWfan was right in one thing,this ME is pretty much '07 ME without arrows (which itself is major improvement), but because of 3D we can see some things that were not that obvious in 2D.

Indeed, and it's exactly those obvious things which make it mediocre.

Indeed, and it's exactly those obvious things which make it mediocre.

And yet, lot of people are using 7.0.2 as cornerstone and "last good ME". It is bugs from there and extreme lack of animations that are causing most of the problems.I have complaint about 2 major things in this ME and one of them was not in 9.1 (to easy to get 1 on 1 against AI).But still, every game that i lost or won i can say why that happened.

If i can have career average of goals against 0.8/per match, with lowly Newport Co, while playing with hardcore LL rules, then defense can't be that awful.

And lot of people that are complaining ,are complaining for some reasons that can be easily personal, like game is to hard , to many injuries, my favorite team /player doesn't play as god almighty, etc... Most of those things are pretty much without any substantial ground, unlike some valid things that other state.

I usually read 3-4 different forums(1 of them is even non-english) and unlike previous years , this is only forum that is having some upheaval. Other ones are completely quiet.That pretty much tells me something.

I'm sick of these threads

Perhaps SI should listen then and improve the game?

This is a guy who like myself plays the game to death so stupidly dismissing what is said just because you like to buttkiss SI is a bit daft.

As said before though I think the 3D ME has uncovered a few 2D FM08 flaws that we did not notice before.

If i can have career average of goals against 0.8/per match, with lowly Newport Co, while playing with hardcore LL rules, then defense can't be that awful.

Yes, but the problem isn't that, overall, defences are bad. The end results are OK. But the way in which the ME gets to them is the difficulty.

Defenders generally behave stupidly, whether they are AI or human managed. So, to keep results realistic a lot of chances are missed which shouldn't have been. For example, you get a load of one on ones, too many to be realistic, because defenders act in a silly way and therefore really good strikers keep missing because otherwise scores would be much too high. I also feel that it is too easy to get crosses in - as a result, even people with good crossing stats put a lot of poor ones in - I'd rather see fewer crosses but better ones when they do come.

Yes, but the problem isn't that, overall, defences are bad. The end results are OK. But the way in which the ME gets to them is the difficulty.

Defenders generally behave stupidly, whether they are AI or human managed. So, to keep results realistic a lot of chances are missed which shouldn't have been. For example, you get a load of one on ones, too many to be realistic, because defenders act in a silly way and therefore really good strikers keep missing because otherwise scores would be much too high.

Yes i know that , however , AI doesn't get to many chances against me, almost no 1v1's(i think they were more dangerous in 9.1, but maybe i am wrong). On the other side in 9.2 i am getting way to many times behind their defensive line in 9.2 and that is my major issue.

It took me some time to tweak certain things , not just tactics, and that is outcome. and i don't play defensively, unless trying to hold my lead or opponent is far superior.Almost everything that is keep getting brought up in forums is not happening to me.With "almost" being very important word.

All you need to do is "channel" AI players so they run into direction you want them to, simple as that.

I get reasonable success (got Stenhousemuir to Scottish Div 1) and am comfortably on top of the league with my latest save Italian C2C, also along LLM lines with a side which was predicted to end up 18th). It's not the results which are at issue for me but the way in which they happen. I'm happy enough with my current 3-5-2 setup which I have worked out using TT&F as a basis.

This level of success does not make me any the less painfully aware of the generally poor nature of the ME, the unintuitive nature of the sliders and the unsatisfactory nature of features such as the press conferences and team talks. The OP's points are perfectly reasonable IMO.

Perhaps SI should listen then and improve the game?

This is a guy who like myself plays the game to death so stupidly dismissing what is said just because you like to buttkiss SI is a bit daft.

As said before though I think the 3D ME has uncovered a few 2D FM08 flaws that we did not notice before.

Exactly. I shudder to think what FM would be like if only the Fanboy Army posted on these forums. My guess would be CM would be the dominant product.